Ched Evans

[Kieran]

Anyone been following this horrid saga? For those who don't know him, Ched Evans is a professional footballer in England who's been found guilty of rape and served time in prison, and is currently free on license as part of his sentence. He persists in maintaining his innocence but the court of appeal has thrown out his application to appeal both the sentence and the verdict.

His supporters have publicly named the girl who he raped, causing her to have to move home five times, under threat of violence against her.

The argument that rages is, should Evans be allowed to resume his career as a professional footballer? In favour are those who say he's done his time (not strictly true until the license has finished, apparently) and so should be allowed to make a living at what he's best at.

Against this, it is said that he's shown absolutely no remorse for his actions, and so isn't rehabilitated yet, and that he could no longer be a role model for young children.

Two clubs have tried to sign him - his old club Sheffield United, and Oldham Athletic. Both have decided not to after public campaigns and pressure from sponsors.

Any views on this one?

 

[britbox]

It would largely depend on whether I thought he'd done it or not.

 

[Kieran]

It would largely depend on whether I thought he'd done it or not.

He had his day in court, and was found guilty. Based upon what I've read about the incident, he sounds like your typical entitled, misogynist footballer. Personally, I think it's a dodgy one, because the legal argument that once he's done his time, he should be free to live his life and return to his job is a sound one.

But I don't like the idea of convicted rapists being champions for kids to idolise and cheer, either. Also, female fans, too. But it's been argued to me that footballers are neither role models, nor are they "public figures", in the way school teachers are, for example...

 

[britbox]

I agree with Part (b) at least... but based on what i've read the case was very much touch and go, based on how pissed (drunk) the woman was and whether it was drunken mutual consent or she was passed out. He maintained his innocence and served an extra year... so not sure on the original case and I make a personal judgement rather than just basing it on the jury's decision.

 

[Kieran]

I agree with Part (b) at least... but based on what i've read the case was very much touch and go, based on how pissed (drunk) the woman was and whether it was drunken mutual consent or she was passed out. He maintained his innocence and served an extra year... so not sure on the original case and I make a personal judgement rather than just basing it on the jury's decision.

The court of appeal has also looked at it and decided he can't appeal the conviction, or sentence. The law has been sound, so far, and nothing in his trial suggests the girl was either lying, or consented.

But what about the question of whether he should be allowed back into football? Do you think he's done his time, and should be allowed?

 

[britbox]

I agree with Part (b) at least... but based on what i've read the case was very much touch and go, based on how pissed (drunk) the woman was and whether it was drunken mutual consent or she was passed out. He maintained his innocence and served an extra year... so not sure on the original case and I make a personal judgement rather than just basing it on the jury's decision.

The court of appeal has also looked at it and decided he can't appeal the conviction, or sentence. The law has been sound, so far, and nothing in his trial suggests the girl was either lying, or consented.

But what about the question of whether he should be allowed back into football? Do you think he's done his time, and should be allowed?

If I was convinced he'd done it (personally) then no, if I was running a football club then he wouldn't get a look in.

With regard to the original case - I'm really not so sure whether he was guilty or not. It's definitely not a straightforward open and shut case. A lot of drunken rape cases involve a "his word against hers"...

 

[Kieran]

I agree with Part (b) at least... but based on what i've read the case was very much touch and go, based on how pissed (drunk) the woman was and whether it was drunken mutual consent or she was passed out. He maintained his innocence and served an extra year... so not sure on the original case and I make a personal judgement rather than just basing it on the jury's decision.

The court of appeal has also looked at it and decided he can't appeal the conviction, or sentence. The law has been sound, so far, and nothing in his trial suggests the girl was either lying, or consented.

But what about the question of whether he should be allowed back into football? Do you think he's done his time, and should be allowed?

If I was convinced he'd done it (personally) then no, if I was running a football club then he wouldn't get a look in.

With regard to the original case - I'm really not so sure whether he was guilty or not. It's definitely not a straightforward open and shut case. A lot of drunken rape cases involve a "his word against hers"...

Well, that's the truth, and unfortunately a lot of girls don't come forward because of fear of not being believed, as well as the fact they don't want to relive it. In this case, the girl has had her anonymity broken and her life further ruined by people who've decided to take a witch-hunt against her. None of these actions are the fault of Evans, by the way, but they're indicative of a moral decline. Head of the PFA Gordon Taylor's egregious remarks, comparing it to Hillsborough, don't help anyone.

As to the case itself, certain things are beyond dispute, and one of them is that he had his day in court, and his own admissions don't do him any favours. Very few rape allegations are upheld, but this one was, and as I say, the court of appeal also looked at it and threw it out.

I agree with you on the personal view that if you were running a football club, he shouldn't be allowed near. I think both clubs have shown a disregard for public opinion (which is their right) but they haven't had the courage to follow through and act on their conviction, which was to sign Evans. Either they should, or they shouldn't. I think the clubs have come out of this very badly. I have no qualms with people coming back into society after serving their time, but not in jobs of immense privilege, and regardless of the arguments otherwise, a footballer is a role model, and he is a public figure...

 

[britbox]

The court of appeal has also looked at it and decided he can't appeal the conviction, or sentence. The law has been sound, so far, and nothing in his trial suggests the girl was either lying, or consented.

But what about the question of whether he should be allowed back into football? Do you think he's done his time, and should be allowed?

If I was convinced he'd done it (personally) then no, if I was running a football club then he wouldn't get a look in.

With regard to the original case - I'm really not so sure whether he was guilty or not. It's definitely not a straightforward open and shut case. A lot of drunken rape cases involve a "his word against hers"...

Well, that's the truth, and unfortunately a lot of girls don't come forward because of fear of not being believed, as well as the fact they don't want to relive it. In this case, the girl has had her anonymity broken and her life further ruined by people who've decided to take a witch-hunt against her. None of these actions are the fault of Evans, by the way, but they're indicative of a moral decline. Head of the PFA Gordon Taylor's egregious remarks, comparing it to Hillsborough, don't help anyone.

As to the case itself, certain things are beyond dispute, and one of them is that he had his day in court, and his own admissions don't do him any favours. Very few rape allegations are upheld, but this one was, and as I say, the court of appeal also looked at it and threw it out.

I agree with you on the personal view that if you were running a football club, he shouldn't be allowed near. I think both clubs have shown a disregard for public opinion (which is their right) but they haven't had the courage to follow through and act on their conviction, which was to sign Evans. Either they should, or they shouldn't. I think the clubs have come out of this very badly. I have no qualms with people coming back into society after serving their time, but not in jobs of immense privilege, and regardless of the arguments otherwise, a footballer is a role model, and he is a public figure...

Well, sport have a habit of "forgiveness" when it comes down to crime. Money rules and for the biggest stars, the establishment kicks in.

Not that this guy fits that criteria, but you get the gist.

 

[Kieran]

Well, sport have a habit of "forgiveness" when it comes down to crime. Money rules and for the biggest stars, the establishment kicks in.

Not that this guy fits that criteria, but you get the gist.

That's the truth. They're very pragmatic in squeezing what they can out of a commodity...

 

[britbox]

^ I wan't a massive basketball fan, but tuned in sometimes and always supported the Lakers... until Kobe raped that chick. I'll wait for him to retire before I buy in again.

 

[brokenshoelace]

I wouldn't say he should be flat out banned from Football, but shame on the club who signs him.

 

[Kieran]

^^ That's about the extent of it, actually...

 

[Murat Baslamisli]

2 cents:
- Never believed athletes or other public figures should be role models. They are there to play a sport and most of them are clueless. On the anniversary of Mandela's passing, a famous hockey player was interviewed and was asked what he thought about Mandela's legacy, he said he was a great player and he enjoyed watching him skate...Uhm, :s

-If this guy was an accountant, was he going to be able to go back to accounting? Most likely. Playing sports is a job too. And a lot of arseholes play it, like it or not. This guy sounds like a douche but I believe he should be allowed to earn a living doing what he knows. He is not going to be a lawyer at this point, I don't think.

Not condoning anything, just saying if football is all he knows, let him play.

 

[Kieran]

2 cents:
- Never believed athletes or other public figures should be role models. They are there to play a sport and most of them are clueless. On the anniversary of Mandela's passing, a famous hockey player was interviewed and was asked what he thought about Mandela's legacy, he said he was a great player and he enjoyed watching him skate...Uhm, :s

-If this guy was an accountant, was he going to be able to go back to accounting? Most likely. Playing sports is a job too. And a lot of arseholes play it, like it or not. This guy sounds like a douche but I believe he should be allowed to earn a living doing what he knows. He is not going to be a lawyer at this point, I don't think.

Not condoning anything, just saying if football is all he knows, let him play.

Good points, Murat, but I imagine that football is what he's prolly best at - but he knows how to sweep streets - or football stadiums - and he can find a different re-entry to society than one which glorifies his trade and makes him an (unwitting, maybe) role model.

The Nelson Mandela anecdote is so funny because it's true, I almost wept laughing! :laydownlaughing